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	<title>Comments on: Hot Roofs: A Misnomer</title>
	<atom:link href="http://www.structuretech1.com/2009/03/hot-roofs-a-misnomer/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://www.structuretech1.com/2009/03/hot-roofs-a-misnomer/</link>
	<description>Home Inspections in the Twin Cities</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Thu, 17 May 2012 09:32:51 +0000</lastBuildDate>
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		<title>By: Reuben Saltzman</title>
		<link>http://www.structuretech1.com/2009/03/hot-roofs-a-misnomer/comment-page-1/#comment-5180</link>
		<dc:creator>Reuben Saltzman</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 24 Feb 2012 02:25:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.structuretech1.com/newsite/?p=236#comment-5180</guid>
		<description>I&#039;m guessing your best option would be to leave a 1&quot; air space, because hot roofs are really supposed to be done with the foam applied directly to the roof decking so no air can possibly get in between the insulation and the roof boards.  You might want to find an engineer get you a definite answer though; this is just my best guess.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;m guessing your best option would be to leave a 1&#8243; air space, because hot roofs are really supposed to be done with the foam applied directly to the roof decking so no air can possibly get in between the insulation and the roof boards.  You might want to find an engineer get you a definite answer though; this is just my best guess.</p>
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		<title>By: Local Dude</title>
		<link>http://www.structuretech1.com/2009/03/hot-roofs-a-misnomer/comment-page-1/#comment-5177</link>
		<dc:creator>Local Dude</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 23 Feb 2012 22:16:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.structuretech1.com/newsite/?p=236#comment-5177</guid>
		<description>Great info!..  I have a 1 &amp; 1/2 in Arden Hills, previous owners have added 2x2s to the 2x6s before dry walling the ceiling in the attic, leaving a 7&quot; gap.  Right now there is under performing fiberglass insulation  with much being displaced by past squirrels.  I want to tear this out and replace.  I have access to many 3&quot;x6&quot;x8 foot pieces of Dow Highload 40 Styrofoam.  I intend on placing them side by side to create a 6&quot;(R-30) thick piece of foam to install between the rafters.  The question I have, is it best to leave the 1&quot; air gap, or fill it with one last piece of foil faced foam and make it a “hot roof”?  And if foil faced foam is suggested, do I face the foil out or in?  The roof faces due south. Thanks for any information.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Great info!..  I have a 1 &amp; 1/2 in Arden Hills, previous owners have added 2x2s to the 2x6s before dry walling the ceiling in the attic, leaving a 7&#8243; gap.  Right now there is under performing fiberglass insulation  with much being displaced by past squirrels.  I want to tear this out and replace.  I have access to many 3&#8243;x6&#8243;x8 foot pieces of Dow Highload 40 Styrofoam.  I intend on placing them side by side to create a 6&#8243;(R-30) thick piece of foam to install between the rafters.  The question I have, is it best to leave the 1&#8243; air gap, or fill it with one last piece of foil faced foam and make it a “hot roof”?  And if foil faced foam is suggested, do I face the foil out or in?  The roof faces due south. Thanks for any information.</p>
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		<title>By: Reuben Saltzman</title>
		<link>http://www.structuretech1.com/2009/03/hot-roofs-a-misnomer/comment-page-1/#comment-4865</link>
		<dc:creator>Reuben Saltzman</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 05 Jan 2012 13:08:49 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.structuretech1.com/newsite/?p=236#comment-4865</guid>
		<description>Tony - check out that link I included at the end of the post - &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.eere.energy.gov/buildings/building_america/pdfs/db/30938.pdf .  &quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;http://www.eere.energy.gov/buildings/building_america/pdfs/db/30938.pdf&lt;/a&gt; .  It&#039;s all about how hot roofs perform in hot climates.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Tony &#8211; check out that link I included at the end of the post &#8211; <a href="http://www.eere.energy.gov/buildings/building_america/pdfs/db/30938.pdf .  " rel="nofollow">http://www.eere.energy.gov/buildings/building_america/pdfs/db/30938.pdf</a> .  It&#8217;s all about how hot roofs perform in hot climates.</p>
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		<title>By: tony</title>
		<link>http://www.structuretech1.com/2009/03/hot-roofs-a-misnomer/comment-page-1/#comment-4860</link>
		<dc:creator>tony</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 04 Jan 2012 03:51:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.structuretech1.com/newsite/?p=236#comment-4860</guid>
		<description>come back to me in 10 years when your 30 year architectural shingle is blistered beyond belief. maybe not as quick in the north, but hot roofs get REAL hot in georgia.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>come back to me in 10 years when your 30 year architectural shingle is blistered beyond belief. maybe not as quick in the north, but hot roofs get REAL hot in georgia.</p>
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		<title>By: Reuben Saltzman</title>
		<link>http://www.structuretech1.com/2009/03/hot-roofs-a-misnomer/comment-page-1/#comment-3732</link>
		<dc:creator>Reuben Saltzman</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 23 Aug 2011 23:32:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.structuretech1.com/newsite/?p=236#comment-3732</guid>
		<description>Hi Robert, 

Yes, I would certainly be concerned about thermal bridging.  As far as vent space above this, I&#039;m really not sure if this would help.  It makes sense, but you are suggesting an insulation method that I&#039;ve never seen before.   I think your best bet would be to consult with an engineer.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hi Robert, </p>
<p>Yes, I would certainly be concerned about thermal bridging.  As far as vent space above this, I&#8217;m really not sure if this would help.  It makes sense, but you are suggesting an insulation method that I&#8217;ve never seen before.   I think your best bet would be to consult with an engineer.</p>
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		<title>By: Robert</title>
		<link>http://www.structuretech1.com/2009/03/hot-roofs-a-misnomer/comment-page-1/#comment-3731</link>
		<dc:creator>Robert</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 23 Aug 2011 22:42:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.structuretech1.com/newsite/?p=236#comment-3731</guid>
		<description>I have an engineered log home built in 1979 that has cathedral ceilings &amp; no attic space. The current &quot;hot roof&quot; has only about 3 1/2&quot; of rigid insulation &amp; we had ice dams last winter. I am considering tearing off the shingles, adding 2x4&#039;s on edge to the existing deck, &amp; filling with polyurethane spray foam, then applying a new deck &amp; shingles. Should I be concerned about thermal bridging? Do I need to add any vent space above the foam to prevent ice damming?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I have an engineered log home built in 1979 that has cathedral ceilings &amp; no attic space. The current &#8220;hot roof&#8221; has only about 3 1/2&#8243; of rigid insulation &amp; we had ice dams last winter. I am considering tearing off the shingles, adding 2&#215;4&#8242;s on edge to the existing deck, &amp; filling with polyurethane spray foam, then applying a new deck &amp; shingles. Should I be concerned about thermal bridging? Do I need to add any vent space above the foam to prevent ice damming?</p>
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		<title>By: Reuben Saltzman</title>
		<link>http://www.structuretech1.com/2009/03/hot-roofs-a-misnomer/comment-page-1/#comment-3230</link>
		<dc:creator>Reuben Saltzman</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 24 May 2011 01:41:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.structuretech1.com/newsite/?p=236#comment-3230</guid>
		<description>Yes, I still had to pull snow off my roof, but I only filled the 3 1/2&quot; rafters with foam.  If I were to do it again, I would have made some type of thermal break in the wood framing, such as using sheets of rigid foam.  I don&#039;t think R38 is a magic number, it just happens to be the minimum amount that is allowed in new construction in Minnesota.

The more the better, of course, but I&#039;m certain that an R32 roof with closed cell foam would outperform an R38 roof with dense pack cellulose.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Yes, I still had to pull snow off my roof, but I only filled the 3 1/2&#8243; rafters with foam.  If I were to do it again, I would have made some type of thermal break in the wood framing, such as using sheets of rigid foam.  I don&#8217;t think R38 is a magic number, it just happens to be the minimum amount that is allowed in new construction in Minnesota.</p>
<p>The more the better, of course, but I&#8217;m certain that an R32 roof with closed cell foam would outperform an R38 roof with dense pack cellulose.</p>
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		<title>By: Nate</title>
		<link>http://www.structuretech1.com/2009/03/hot-roofs-a-misnomer/comment-page-1/#comment-3229</link>
		<dc:creator>Nate</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 23 May 2011 18:33:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.structuretech1.com/newsite/?p=236#comment-3229</guid>
		<description>Thanks! I think you&#039;re reading that right... One last question - we have 2x4 rafters, and will only get ~R23 in that space. Adding 2x2s before spraying would get up to R32, but everything I&#039;m reading says in our zone we&#039;d need at least R38. Are you still pulling snow off your roof to prevent ice dams? I&#039;m not clear on how anything less than R38 would work in our climate (referencing this PDF: http://www.jlconline.com/cgi-local/viewnew.pdf/6196781a55e19961fb4ab636ff531a75/2eeb3ff87f8333cb4240d3d94cf3605d/www.jlconline.com/cgi-bin/jlconline.storefront/4d5ae0cf0aae86e927170a32100a0694)

I&#039;m really leaning towards a hot roof but I need to resolve a few more questions and check our budget... Thanks!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks! I think you&#8217;re reading that right&#8230; One last question &#8211; we have 2&#215;4 rafters, and will only get ~R23 in that space. Adding 2x2s before spraying would get up to R32, but everything I&#8217;m reading says in our zone we&#8217;d need at least R38. Are you still pulling snow off your roof to prevent ice dams? I&#8217;m not clear on how anything less than R38 would work in our climate (referencing this PDF: <a href="http://www.jlconline.com/cgi-local/viewnew.pdf/6196781a55e19961fb4ab636ff531a75/2eeb3ff87f8333cb4240d3d94cf3605d/www.jlconline.com/cgi-bin/jlconline.storefront/4d5ae0cf0aae86e927170a32100a0694" rel="nofollow">http://www.jlconline.com/cgi-local/viewnew.pdf/6196781a55e19961fb4ab636ff531a75/2eeb3ff87f8333cb4240d3d94cf3605d/www.jlconline.com/cgi-bin/jlconline.storefront/4d5ae0cf0aae86e927170a32100a0694</a>)</p>
<p>I&#8217;m really leaning towards a hot roof but I need to resolve a few more questions and check our budget&#8230; Thanks!</p>
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		<title>By: Reuben Saltzman</title>
		<link>http://www.structuretech1.com/2009/03/hot-roofs-a-misnomer/comment-page-1/#comment-3227</link>
		<dc:creator>Reuben Saltzman</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 23 May 2011 10:14:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.structuretech1.com/newsite/?p=236#comment-3227</guid>
		<description>Hey Nate, most of this blog is free advice :). 

&lt;em&gt;Here is what the code says:  R314.5.3 Attics. The thermal barrier specified in Section
314.4 is not required where attic access is required by Section
R807.1 and where the space is entered only for service
of utilities and when the foam plastic insulation is protected
against ignition using one of the following ignition barrier
materials:
1. 1.5-inch-thick (38 mm) mineral fiber insulation;
2. 0.25-inch-thick (6.4 mm) wood structural panels;
3. 0.375-inch (9.5 mm) particleboard;
4. 0.25-inch (6.4 mm) hardboard;
5. 0.375-inch (9.5 mm) gypsum board; or
6. Corrosion-resistant steel having a base metal thickness
of 0.016 inch (0.406 mm).
The above ignition barrier is not required where the foam
plastic insulation has been tested in accordance with Section
R314.6.&lt;/em&gt;

My interpretation of R304.5.3 is that you still need to have the foam covered inside the knee walls, but you can use 3/8&quot; drywall in those locations.  If the Minneapolis permit inspector in your area has a different take on that section, please let me know.

- Reuben</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hey Nate, most of this blog is free advice <img src='http://www.structuretech1.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' /> . </p>
<p><em>Here is what the code says:  R314.5.3 Attics. The thermal barrier specified in Section<br />
314.4 is not required where attic access is required by Section<br />
R807.1 and where the space is entered only for service<br />
of utilities and when the foam plastic insulation is protected<br />
against ignition using one of the following ignition barrier<br />
materials:<br />
1. 1.5-inch-thick (38 mm) mineral fiber insulation;<br />
2. 0.25-inch-thick (6.4 mm) wood structural panels;<br />
3. 0.375-inch (9.5 mm) particleboard;<br />
4. 0.25-inch (6.4 mm) hardboard;<br />
5. 0.375-inch (9.5 mm) gypsum board; or<br />
6. Corrosion-resistant steel having a base metal thickness<br />
of 0.016 inch (0.406 mm).<br />
The above ignition barrier is not required where the foam<br />
plastic insulation has been tested in accordance with Section<br />
R314.6.</em></p>
<p>My interpretation of R304.5.3 is that you still need to have the foam covered inside the knee walls, but you can use 3/8&#8243; drywall in those locations.  If the Minneapolis permit inspector in your area has a different take on that section, please let me know.</p>
<p>- Reuben</p>
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		<title>By: Nate</title>
		<link>http://www.structuretech1.com/2009/03/hot-roofs-a-misnomer/comment-page-1/#comment-3224</link>
		<dc:creator>Nate</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 23 May 2011 02:30:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.structuretech1.com/newsite/?p=236#comment-3224</guid>
		<description>Incredibly happy to have found this blog. We&#039;re in the middle of huge brainstorming session to solve our 1.5 story house&#039;s issues: ice dams, ventilation, bad existing insulation, etc... And a hot roof is looking like the solution to many of these issues. Regarding Chris&#039;s comment 3/28, if we tear the drywall out of our finished half story down to the rafters, add 2x2s, spray in foam on the roof decking, can we just put drywall back on the kneewall and inner ceiling an consider the foam &quot;covered&quot;? Or do we need to put drywall over the foam all the way to the attic floor AND finish the kneewall? There are access doors in each kneewall, if that matters, and we&#039;re in Minneapolis. (Also I realize this is basically asking for free advise, but I guarantee you&#039;re my guy next time I ever need a house inspection... :)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Incredibly happy to have found this blog. We&#8217;re in the middle of huge brainstorming session to solve our 1.5 story house&#8217;s issues: ice dams, ventilation, bad existing insulation, etc&#8230; And a hot roof is looking like the solution to many of these issues. Regarding Chris&#8217;s comment 3/28, if we tear the drywall out of our finished half story down to the rafters, add 2x2s, spray in foam on the roof decking, can we just put drywall back on the kneewall and inner ceiling an consider the foam &#8220;covered&#8221;? Or do we need to put drywall over the foam all the way to the attic floor AND finish the kneewall? There are access doors in each kneewall, if that matters, and we&#8217;re in Minneapolis. (Also I realize this is basically asking for free advise, but I guarantee you&#8217;re my guy next time I ever need a house inspection&#8230; <img src='http://www.structuretech1.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
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